On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 18:59:02 GMT, Sum wrote:
>Neuman - Ruether wrote:
>>>>On Fri, 29 Nov 2002 02:22:44 GMT, Sum
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Never owned a HDTV before so I am reading various reviews and
>>>>>comparisons on the net. One professional review caught my eye when
>>>>>reviewing a Samsung HDTV, it says:
>>>>>"However, it's important to note that once it's properly adjusted, the TV
>>>>>produced a sharp picture with decent color, though wiithout any
>>>>>adjustment, the color temperature was quite blue. As is the case with
>>>>>most high-end TVs, it's well worth paying a few hundred dollars extra
>>>>>for a professional calibration in order to get the best picture
>>>>>possible. For instance, before calibration, our review sample showed
>>>>>geometric distortions, such as slightly bowed edges along the sides of
>>>>>the picture in Normal mode. Scan-velocity modulation (SVM) was also set
>>>>>too high, causing barely visible rings to form around edges of text and
>>>>>other lines."
>>>>>a few hundreds dollars to have it calibrated? What is involved and does
>>>>>people really do this?

>>>Neuman - Ruether wrote:
>>>
>>>>Most TVs are at least slightly "out of adjustment"...
>>>>If you look at a wall of various TVs, while the color
>>>>matching is FAR better than it was when I looked for a
>>>>27" TV about 10 years ago, you will notice BIG differences
>>>>in the quality of text display, the presence of a lot of
>>>>red edges on things, poor focus in some or all areas of the
>>>>screens, bad distortions of straight lines, slight picture
>>>>rotation, etc. Many of the problems are hard to correct
>>>>(which is why I always buy a floor [display] model that
>>>>looks good over a "new in box" sample, even at the same
>>>>price...). The 27" I bought 10 years ago was excellent
>>>>in every respect but one: color balance. I took off
>>>>the rear cover and adjusted the color (DO NOT DO THIS
>>>>WITHOUT SOME KNOWLEDGE!), and now still have a very sharp
>>>>TV with minimal picture problems that is still fun to watch.
>>>>BTW, here is a good test for resolution: can you easily
>>>>read the Ditech (and other mortgage and car-ad) 1/2
>>>>screen or so of "fine print"? With standard cable broadcast
>>>>service (340 lines max...), my old 27" and 20" TVs show
>>>>the "fine print" cleanly...
>>>>David Ruether

>>On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 05:13:53 GMT, Sum
>>wrote:
>>
>>>Thanks for the information. Based on what you said, I went to a local
>>>AV stores which has many TV models side by side and they were all
>>>playing Monster's Inc. it was near the end. I waited till the movie
>>>ends and watched the credit rolled and compared the TVs and you are
>>>absolutely right. I actually saw a $3499 Sony next to a $849 Sony and
>>>the 849 model had better and sharper text. The $3499 actually had a
>>>while blur between the alphabets and other TVs had red edges, and showed
>>>all kinds of flaws. So it means all these TV really need calibration to
>>>look their best? I never knew this before so what is the best approach
>>>if I want a particular model and size? Guess I have to either learn how
>>>to calibrate it myself (by reading up on it is it possible? I am no
>>>electrician but I am a civil engineer with little knowledge of
>>>electronics, just what level of expertise is required?), or buy it from
>>>a high end AV store and request to have a technician test and calibrate
>>>it before I take it home (and probably pay a premium for it - doubt that
>>>the local BestBuy will be able to do this), what other options do I have?
>>>Thanks again,
>>>Sum

>>[Best to bottom-post, to keep thread intact - I
>>rearranged the text above to permit this...]
>>
>>Oh-oh! Once you get critical of convergence, focus,
>>resolution, color, and geometry, you will not like
>>most TVs of any price...! ;-) Most dealers will have
>>no idea of what you are complaining about (or so they
>>will say...;-), let alone have the ability to correct
>>problems. The only problem that is fairly easy to
>>fix is color balance, but this is complicated by the
>>proximity of adjustment points to high-voltage, by
>>control interactions, and by the separation of some
>>of the color's controls for shadow and highlights...
>>Best: look at the TVs of interest at many stores until
>>you find one you like in every way but for color,
>>then have that adjusted as you watch... (it took
>>me almost three months to find my 27", and several
>>weeks to find my last 20" - while generally driving
>>salesmen and friends nuts...;-)
>>Good luck!
>> David Ruether

>If that is true I am in trouble - my wife will kill me before I find my
>ideal TV. So the only way to do it is to go from store to store and
>hope to find the best one with the right model, size and price? What if
>I was looking for a Sony but end up finding a Tatung which is not in the
>radar screen of my short list of manufacturer?

When I looked, I kept in mind the 2-3 best brands for
durability (ask a TV repair service what does, and doesn't,
commonly appear for repairs - at the time I was interested,
10 years ago, Sony and Panasonic had the reputation for
best reliability). I bought a Quasar demo (made by Panasonic
at the time) after the long search (though similar models
showed TERRIBLE misadjustment...), and ignored the rather
nice pictures of the RCAs and GEs, due to their poor service
reputations at the time... One of my good TV's now, though
is an old 20" RCA, bought cheap used (though the side-edge
distortion is quite high...).

>Now I would assume geometry, resolution and focus are qualities that are
>non-subjective, meaning that no one would want an out of focus setting
>or one with bad geometric distortion. So why doesn't the factory set
>all their TV's to optimal settings, and let the consumer deal with only
>subjective parameters like colors?

Money. It is relatively quick and easy to manufacture
a TV, but it takes FAR more effort and time (and employee
training/skill) to properly adjust the result to a
standard that only a relative few appreciate... Remember
when you did not notice the poor text rendering, red edges,
un-straight lines, color biases, etc.? ;-) Most people don't
notice these problems - but they will pay "big bucks" for
HDTVs that cannot produce a picture that is as good as a
good-quality well-adjusted SDTV... Marketing over value,
again...;-) And, I will be looking for a good-quality,
well-adjusted HDTV in about 2-3 years, darn...! ;-)