On Thu, 10 May 2001 18:56:07 -0700, "Richard Crowley" wrote:

>"Neuman - Ruether" wrote ...
>> But, once again, THERE IS NO "HISS" PROBLEM!
>> You are simply extending the life of a silly rumor that
>> hurts the reputation of the best compact Mini-DV camera
>> out there by continuing these posts.

>This is the kind of absolutist blanket statement that thoughtful people
>avoid making. I am astounded that Mr. Ruether would make such a
>prononcement. I had come to think of him as a sensible source of reliable
>information. His opinion certainly doesn't correlate to the first-hand
>experience of scores (hundreds?) of VX-2000 owners.

This was my point - I'm tired of reading about these
owners, when in fact they appear (mostly) not to be
first-hand ("I've heard...", "Is there still a problem...?")
type comments - extended rumors that perpetuate, often based
on second/third/etc.-hand comments/questions, and sometimes
based on first-hand (but ill-informed technically) comments.
There are, as I have tried to point out, SEVERAL ways to
quite easily hear "hiss" with a VX-2000, but these are
easily dismissed and avoided with decent recording
technique...
But still the rumors and beliefs continue, even in the face
of little solid evidence that this is a problem...
Interesting.....;-)

>If there had not been an audio problem with the VX-2000, Sony would have
>never gone to the extraordinary measure of posting this web page:
>http://www.sel.sony.com/SEL/service/dcrvx2000.shtml They have never (to my
>knowledge) before or since, posted such a "disclaimer" for any other issue
>with any other piece of consumer or pro equipment.

I think it is an attempt to stem the rumors, and
a reasonable one, as was Canon's when the "banding"
problem appeared with the XL-1 - but people don't
want to believe it is as simple as Sony/Canon
presented, and a "problem" as easily avoided...
People want to believe that Canon/Sony are just too
evil/lazy/whatever to correct a "problem" (that
doesn't exist), rather than believe the truth, I guess...

>If there had not been an audio problem with the VX-2000, you wouldn't find
>dozens of web pages devoted to the topic, such as:
>http://www.global-dvc.org/html/VX2000.asp

This is a notorious "rumor" site, as I recall...?

>Try "VX-2000" or "VX2000" and
>"hiss" or "audio" on your favorite search engine. You likely won't find any
>problem documented to this extent with any other make or model camera.

"Documented", or just discussed...?
And, just how DO you kill a rumor, anyway...? ;-)

>Furthermore, Sony acknowledged that they blew it with the similar pro model
>(PD-150) and fixed them for free (except loss of income from having your
>camera gone for weeks!)

If what I've heard about the "fix" is true (and this
may be just a rumor...;-), the "fix" was a top-end
roll-off. That would improve S/N, but at the cost
of audio bandwidth - but casual assessment of the
"hiss problem" would then indicate it had been
"fixed". But, so would not basing the assessment
of the "problem" on headphone monitoring, or
unrealistically-set record/play levels, or mismatched
gains - but this would require too much "thoughtfulness"...;-)

>I suspect that Sony has quietly (no pun intended!) fixed the problem inline,
>but is unwilling to fix the VX-2000s because of their non-pro status.
>Instead, they explain it away on their web page (URL cited above). I don't
>know of any reliable audio engineers that believe a word of that
>"explanation".

If you read it, it does make sense...
What else can Sony do - recall every VX-2000, wave
a wand over it, and declare it "fixed" (which is
essentially what they may have done with the PD150...;-),
and return it with explicit instructions on how to set
audio levels and match mics to the inputs...? ;-) Again,
what problem? I have yet to see ONE solid report of a
REAL hiss problem from ANY owner or user of a VX-2000
in any of these video NGs (and I've been here a while...;-)
that is not explainable in a way that exonerates the
VX-2000 - and I suspect there are a LOT of VX-2000
users here... (I have two, myself, bought well over a
year ago, without the "problem"...;-).

>I have been a big Sony fan for almost 40 years. I have lots of Sony audio
>and Video equipment, consumer, as well as professional. But the VX-2000
>audio problem makes me wonder about them sometimes. Sony is a very big
>multinational company, and the bean counters defeated the engineers on that
>one.

Again, WHAT PROBLEM?
Where is the evidence???
(I do not accept "discussions", "rumors", etc. about it,
nor the experience of people who report it in a way that
indicates alternate reasons for their experience. Solid
reporting by audio-knowledgeable people is acceptable,
but I have seen VERY LITTLE of this... Gosh, I
wonder why...;-)
I'm no fan of "big corporations", nor, as an "audiomaniac",
have I generally liked Sony audio gear, but this VX-2000
"hiss problem" thingy is just plain unfair...

>I am glad that the PD-150 I bought for the office was manufactured AFTER the
>problem was fixed.

It would be interesting to compare its FR with one that
had the, er, "problem"...;-) As I pointed out earlier, these
are "pro-sumer"-grade video devices, ones that perform VERY
well for both picture and sound quality compared with
similar-level gear offered only a few years ago - but the
picture is not HDTV-quality, and the sound is not CD/DAT-
quality. But both are VERY good quality for consumer,
and even many pro, video purposes. Why holler over
nothing - and "bad-mouth" such a good thing...?!
And, as I also pointed out before, there is an easy
solution for those who fear "the problem" - buy from
a dealer that accepts returns/refunds... (I suspect that
very few VX-2000s are returned as a result of hearing
excessive "hiss".;-)