Hi--

(I wrote a lot of this last night, did a rapid shut-down due to
lightning, and lost it all...)

>>Hmmm, passive line stages......;-) Now, don't get me started again! ;-)

>It's hard to imagine why passibe line stages would be controversial.
>They're just a switch to select an input and a pot to control volume. Why
>is that a big deal? They are pretty popular with folks who don't have a
>volume control on their CD player or those who don't like preamps but need
>some input switching. Personally I like preamps but I have no problem
>selling passive line stages to folks who want them.

A passive line stage forms a filter with the wire capacitance, which,
depending on the amount of capacitance and the values in the pots, may
be quite audible. Pot size can also affect source impedence, and so,
noise. Active stages have the advantage of properly isolating
impedences and setting ideal in/out impedences. They are also a very
simple design job, which makes one wonder why so many of them aren't
very good... Any designer who fails to make a good low-gain, flat
active isolation stage shouldn't be trusted with anything else...

>Just to make you really
>cringe we're going to use genuine Kimber wire inside. How's that for "high
>end?"

Ooooo-oooow! (Plain ol' bell wire is just fine...)

>>Yes - but I guess in the form of "cyber-stores", not in publishing...;-)

>Dell is doing $12 million per month on their cyber store. It's not all bad.

Yes - the money is there, since that's where the computer nurds are...

>>>I borrowed a pair of $1600 NBS speaker cables from my audio >
>>Now, don't get me started again, again! ;-) Wire-hooeyness is WEIRD!
>>The basic wire concepts are relatively simple, and well-known, yet
>>people believe in the absurd, and spend money on snake-oil (but won't
>>spend it on things that are real...;-)

>I don't disagree with you there. Nevertheless these cables were audible and
>improved my audio playback. Outrageously priced for sure but they were
>effective nevertheless. They're too expensive to cut and inspect the
>innards. I can tell that it is solid wire and it's twisted. The dealer
>tells me the wire is pure silver. I suppose one could make a copy if one
>had some siver wire. If I knew the formula I'd do it myself. They sounded
>good. Incidentally, this is the first time I've ever considered wire to be
>audible. I've done a jillion listening tests before only to conclude that
>wire doesn't matter. This wire made me rethink things. I did return the
>pair to the dealer. I didn't even come close to buying them.

Speaker wire actually is important, but again, the principles are
easy to understand - there is no magic! The amp has an output impedence
that changes with frequency. The speaker has a different input impedence
that changes with frequency. Different wire resistance, inductance, and
capacitance will interact with the above. Since the above are variable
with samples, the only thing you can guarantee is that different wire
characteristics will produce subtly different sound. Since most audible
sound change is first perceived as an improvement, it is easy to sell
wire. (Since most perceived audio changes aren't real, it is easy to
sell most anything to audio nuts [polkadots on walls, green edges and
weights on CDs, bricks on amplifiers...]. Simple blind tests have shown
me how strongly-held beliefs about sound changes simply didn't exist.)
In the case of wire, there is no magic in particular materials for
the conductors (silver is silly and expensive). Do a simple test:
Hook a scope up to the speaker terminals when trying different wires.
Put a 1-volt (out of the amp) square wave into the amp at 1kHz and again
at 10 kHz. With different wires (just differences in wire impedence
characteristics, whick can be reproduced with simple materials/geometries),
you will see slight changes in the square waves, indicating phase and
amplitude shifts. These are subtle, but quite audible.
Hooeyness evaporates!

>>Ah, the smell of money overwhelming sensibility and honesty...;-)

>No. I'm not going to sell them in that sense. I'm just going to fill
>orders for people who've decided elswhere they want the product. I'm just a
>convenient fulfillment house. We'll stock it, offer it and ship it to folks
>who want to part with some money for it. We won't push them on anybody or
>even make recommendations on the web site. We'll list them, price them,
>perhaps provide some photos and provide on line secure ordering.

Ah, good - just what our local quite-reputable "Hi-Fi" store does...;-)

>>There was a story on the news recently that really surprised me.
>>It wasn't that a teen-age girl had done a research project and was
>>published in a major medical journal (surprising, enough...! ;-),
>>it was what she proved: that a "medical" practice engaged in at
>>a surprisingly high percentage of hospitals (and paid for by
>>insurance) had no value - and that practice was the passing of hands
>>above the patient!!! WEIRD!!! We ARE back in the middle ages!
>>Science HAS lost! Reason is NOT valued! WEIRD!!!!! But, then,
>>zillions of people throw their money away on lottery tickets
>>(the higher the prize, and therefore the the smaller the number of
>>prizes, the more popular the lottery...;-) - and on new cars...,
>>and they think sports figures are worth millions of dollars a year...;-)
>>WEIRD!

>Chill, now. I have to say I don't care much for the 90's. I don't like
>what the computer has done to society. I'm completely bummed by things like
>automated attendant telephone answering and increased government intrusion
>in our lives. I hate the fact that our society is so litigious and that we
>have so many lawyers to provide for that. I don't like that people whine
>and complain so much these days and refuse to take responsibility for what
>they do. Everyone is looking for a scapegoat. It reminds me of the
>description of those ancient Italians in the famous book "Rise and Fall of
>the Roman Empire." I'm talking about the fall, of course.

Not the Spring?! ;-) Yes, I agree. Maybe "science" has so escaped the
common-sense level that it has entered the realm of magic for most,
leaving it OK to believe in most anything. Sense has pretty much
disappeared, it seems. "Science" doesn't help much when it starts to
look like religion, as it does to me in the areas of cosmology and
sub-atomic particles. The grand intellectual musings in those fields
begin to resemble Plato's erroneous ramblings on the nature of things...

>On the contrary I think science has won-in the form of the computer. We let
>computers do our commuicating for us and, in some cases our thinking. Not
>good stuff. Yes there are still people who appreciate the arts and
>humanities but our society really values science, business and money (and
>not in that order) in my opinion. Oh, are pro athletes worth hundreds of
>millions? Of course not but they get it because someone is willing to give
>it to them. Coporate CEO's aren't worth seven figure salaries either but
>they get them. The rule apparently is to get what you can however you can
>get it and at the expense of whomever. I remember the 50's and 60's with
>fondness. I don't know whether it was a gentler time or simply that I was
>younger and more naive and less battle scarred. I remember with fondness
>just the same. Good shooting.
>
>Fred

The latter...;-) We have come a long way in reducing some of the mean
narrow-mindedness common in that time. I accuse R. Reagan of resusitating
a fond image not of what was, but the sugary Hollywood image of the times.
I remember the reality. We were all naive. We almost killed ourselves
in silly power struggles. (I still really like 60's house design, though.
And we are definitely in a slump-time in domestic architecture now! ;-)
The environment is cleaner, better understood, and better cared for now; communication at all levels is improved (with the exception of those
&%#$*@ computer telephone answering thingies!); social understanding,
and political-process/power-manipulation is better understood. Big-time
risk-taking is less likely (Cuban missile affair, blowing up an H-bomb
in the ocean without knowing whether or not the ocean would go with
it - wunnerfully stupid things that I trust are now less likely...).
I think we are in a better time now, though it is hardly perfect. The
religious nuttery (everywhere, including audio...;-) bothers me, since
it is belief-based rather than reality-based, the acceptance of which
can set the stage for quickly destroying our gains...
Heave ho!