"Andys cam" <andyscam@aol.com> wrote in message news:20030630184133.04179.00001287@mb-m28.aol.com...

> >While I appreciate the mention, I gotta agree with Andy on the idea that

> >there are lots of segments of the industry... some of whom (including

> >event videographers) might have to get by with a camera-mounted mic,

> >supplanted by wireless lav and/or plant mics.

Yes - sometimes there is little or no time or possibility for placing

alternatives to on-camera mics, and close-in (I like WA lens

converters partly for this reason), a good on-camera mic can

suffice. Some corrections are possible during editing, also...

> >Also, the orignal quote was specifically talking about camera built-in

> >mics, which generally are pretty awful; a good short shot on a shockmount

> >is a definite improvement for those who must use a camera-mounted mic.

> >(For those with the Second Edition of Producing Great Sound, it's on page

> >123.)

There are some situations where a stereo omni is more satisfactory than

a mono shotgun - like when specific voice pickup is not needed, but

"ambience" with stereo effect is; and when music is being recorded,

especially if the quality of the music sound and its consistency as the

camera is turned are important (omnis maintain much more consistent tonal

"color" and amplitude with turning than do shotguns). Some cameras have

fairly decent stereo omni mics built in (the VX1000/2000 do), which I

find very useful for covering musical events, events with music, general

event "ambience", nature material, street scenes, market scenes, etc...

> >By the way, about 90% of my credits haven't made it to my website... does

> >anyone really care that I once recorded ADR for Maxx Headroom?

Yes....;-)

> Thank you Mr. Rose for helping with some additional clarity of this endless

> debate. I did a wedding this weekend (I don't do many, by choice) and half way

> through putting a Senn Evolution wirelesss on the groom, he said 'I don't want

> to wear this' so I took it off. (his gig, not mine!) Fearing this or any other

> audio problem I had already hid a D8 Camcorder (with a dreaded, on-cam shotgun)

> on the alter/pulput/stage to catch audio only. (Martha Mary Chapel at the

> historic Longfellow's Wayside Inn in Sudbury, MA) and of the 3 cams recording

> audio, the dreaded, on-cam shotgun on my VX2000 in the alter/pulput/stage rear

> doorway gave me the best audio. The second camera man in the balcony (PD-150)

> ran manual audio and it was useless as the soft spoken stuff was inaudible and

> the organ/singer was too loud.

I like omnis when the placement is far from the "action" - the general sound

of the place, and the music, are better picked up with these (in stereo),

and the high noise level becomes the "hall sound" and a natural-sounding part

of the final mix...

>The D8 audio was fair but had a bit too much

> motor noise in it.

The Sony 908c is worth the price to get its decent broad-stereo sound, and

also its usable compact shock mount that can be used with other mics.

Cool Edit can help some with steady-state noise reduction, too...

>I have tried a few different combos in my little event

> corner (from PZMs to feeds) over the years and (again in my little corner) have

> got the best, most rounded, most like it actually was audio from the dreaded

> on-cam mikes. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

It's my story, too...;-) One can mic for different ends. If you want a

quiet-background "up-close" studio sound quality, you mic one way;

if you want a natural-sounding mix (which includes lotsa "hall sound"

and noise and good stereo spread - just lotsa good ambience, natural

reverb, etc.) for the "you were there" feel, you mic another way...

BTW, I used to record music - and my preferred method of micing

was the use of two spaced omni mics (only), though this risked high

noise levels - but it resulted in the most natural-sounding recordings

compared with using other micing techniques...

--

David Ruether

d_ruether@hotmail.com

http://www.David-Ruether-Photography.com

Hey, take a gander at www.visitithaca.com, too...!