"someone" <mike@xyz.com> wrote in message news:bp999l01far@enews3.newsguy.com...

> "David Ruether" <rpn1@no-junk.cornell.edu> wrote in message

> news:bp86n8$4am$1@news01.cit.cornell.edu...

> > "someone" <mike@xyz.com> wrote in message

> > news:bp6hlt0nec@enews3.newsguy.com...

> > > You cannot get good sound by recording from the back of the room.

> > This is literally true, but a short shotgun mic and some sound processing

> > afterwards can get acceptable (as in, "intelligible") sound in the situation

> > described - remember that the picture is unlikely to be first-rate either,

> > so spending far more on the sound gear than the camera may not make

> > sense...

> Except the short shotgun is going to pick up the classroom noise better than

> the speaker as the classroom is between the microphone and the speaker.

> Every movement of the chairs, the students in the chairs and their

> inevitable verbalizations.

Yes - that is why I add a wireless lav on the other channel - though

I have gotten quite acceptable results with the shotgun only (as I

pointed out, this is not "pro" work - but if everything is intelligible,

the purpose of the video has been accomplished). The noise level

is rarely excessive in these classroom situations...

> > > Wireless microphone system that are likely to work cost in the

> neighborhood

> > > of $400 and up.

> > The $150 Azden WMS-Pro set offers acceptable performance for

> > a heck of a lot less...

> > > The run from the front of the room to the back is too long to avoid

> noise

> > > with a setup that does not use balanced audio connections. Your camera

> will

> > > not accept input from a balanced microphone without an adapter. XLR

> > > adapters cost around $100 and up.

> > Simple XLR adapters are far cheaper; runs of 50' with single-ended

> > lines (what the camcorder uses) can work fine if the wire is good; I don't

> > recommend method this due to the danger of tripping over the wire.

>

> However, the single-ended cable may end up picking up the local radio

> station as I can tell you from experience. It may also pick up electrical

> noise from light fixtures, the microwave oven down the hall, and the series

> wound motor in the vacuum cleaner the janitor is operating next door.

Not if you have good-quality wire and good connectors. This is not

magic - the interference must be picked up as a difference signal

somewhere - and good wire shielding and connections prevent this.

I used to record music in very large concert halls with more than 50'

single-ended runs of cable in a large city with no interferrence

problems. I get more interference now with the wireless than with

cable, but these are fairly benign "swish" sounds...

> > Standard gear for classroom shooting here: a wireless mic on the speaker

> > on one channel; a short shotgun on the other channel; a $5 Radio

> > Shack dual-mono-to-stereo mini-plug adapter to get into the camera;

> > AGC used; adjust levels and mix the channels while making dubs. The

> > Sennheiser MKE-300 is an acceptable short-shotgun, and it is around

> > $175...

> > > A lavaliere microphone that can be unobtrusively attached to her blouse

> > > will cost somewhere around $150 up.

> > Ummm, acceptable ones are as cheap as $15 (one comes with the

> > Azden set...).

> > > Figure $250 for the microphone and adapter and another $60-$100 for the

> > > balanced cable required to run from the front to the rear of the classroom.

> > Too much gear for the job, unless fully professional results are

> > expected - but then the camera should be replaced, also...

>

> I'd rather have good sound and a not top-end picture than the other way

> around. In a normal classroom situation, that camera should deliver

> acceptable results.

Mebbe, mebbe not... The color balance, sharpness, and AF ability would

need to be better than many 1-chippers can manage, though classroom

lighting is usually sufficient for them...

> > > All of a sudden, the cost of a wireless microphone isn't too bad in

> > > comparison. A good wireless microphone setup that will also connect to

> your

> > > camera can be had from Sennheiser. The bodypack transmitter and

> receiver

> > > along with the lav microphone should be just under $400 if you shop

> around.

> > > It is what I use in my video business.

> > The Senn. Evolution 100 appears to be good, but I can't find it

> > for under $500...

> For $500 people have been getting the 100 with both the body pack and the

> plug-on transmitters. Got to look around but they do get them.

Yes, at B&H, but not for $400"... For some of us, the $500 is too much.

I sometimes use cheap Mini-Disc recorders instead...

> > > There are less expensive wireless microphones available and they may or

> may

> > > not work well in this situation. Make certain you select a wireless

> > > microphone that uses the UHF bands, not the VHF bands (far less noise).

> > > Make certain you can return the kit if it suffers poor performance.

> > That last line is always good advice with video/audio gear...

> > --

> > David Ruether

> > d_ruether@hotmail.com

> > http://www.David-Ruether-Photography.com